tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-27691111.post7401810994540946299..comments2023-07-18T07:27:08.516+00:00Comments on Siren Voices: 136Spence Kennedyhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/11183848895584919812noreply@blogger.comBlogger13125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-27691111.post-83397604483152514192009-03-10T09:06:00.000+00:002009-03-10T09:06:00.000+00:00Hi Anon,It's difficult, isn't it? Whilst I wouldn'...Hi Anon,<BR/>It's difficult, isn't it? Whilst I wouldn't want to go back to a time when people with mental health probs were 'banged up', sometimes indefinitely, it does seem as if we've gone too much the other way in terms of community care.<BR/><BR/>As far as the ambulance goes, we're in a difficult position when it comes to dealing with acute cases. Hospitals aren't set up to handle them, and police cells seem to have become a holding bay.<BR/><BR/>I suppose funding is the key, followed by a cool appraisal of how things are working on a practical level. <BR/><BR/>I don't agree that it's so easy to walk into a mental health care position, though. I don't know that much about it, but in my contacts with the people who work in the day centres, secure units etc, they've always struck me as very professional and motivated people. A cliche, I know - but it's a tough job and I don't think I could do it!<BR/><BR/>Thanks for your comment.Spence Kennedyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11183848895584919812noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-27691111.post-59104990515160449332009-03-09T14:01:00.000+00:002009-03-09T14:01:00.000+00:00Once upon a time, not really so very long ago, the...Once upon a time, not really so very long ago, there were institutions which made some attempt to deal with the Hilarys of this world. Then someone came along in charge who believed it was better that it should all be done "in the community". It didn't matter if it was mental health, disability, in the community was the buzzword. I wouldn't like to say whether the belief that it would be cheaper had a bearing. And then the next step was to take it away from the people who had proper medical training and had an idea of what they were doing. I think it's Dr. Crippen who has written about it recently. Want a job? Go and be a "mental care assistant".<BR/>And the true cost? The murders and suicides we've heard a lot about recently as a result of people who need proper care in the right and secure environment being denied access to it. If someone really wants to commit either they will do it sooner or later - but if the desire is because of an illness that could be dealt with they should have access to that right and proper care. And if not, then the rest of society needs to know they are not being put at risk.<BR/>I weep for what the British system has become. Mental health care is truely a poor relation, but the NHS itself is not to blame - it's the big boys (and a girl) who have interferred without knowing what they were doing and who continue to do so in so many other fields too. Nor is it any one political party - they're both culpable.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-27691111.post-53674877196143591562009-01-30T21:27:00.000+00:002009-01-30T21:27:00.000+00:00Another great post Spence. Steve sounds like a se...Another great post Spence. Steve sounds like a seriously good cop, and I think all of you did the best thing you could in very difficult circumstances with very limited options. Hope Hilary gets the follow-up help she clearly needs, but I'm pessimistic on that, to be honest.Anonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05827897335869342668noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-27691111.post-5522787544476390152009-01-30T20:16:00.000+00:002009-01-30T20:16:00.000+00:00It's unbelievably awful to think of Hilary being s...It's unbelievably awful to think of Hilary being stripped, given prison clothes and put in a cell, even if it was just for 24hrs. I can't imagine the depth of despair she must have felt. It made me feel quite sick.Spence Kennedyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11183848895584919812noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-27691111.post-35658749113311784652009-01-30T12:35:00.000+00:002009-01-30T12:35:00.000+00:00Makes one realise how lucky one is not to feel so ...Makes one realise how lucky one is not to feel so much despair that ending it all seems the only option left.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-27691111.post-78876497151826482752009-01-29T09:33:00.000+00:002009-01-29T09:33:00.000+00:00Hi Liv,You're right, Hilary's friend must've felt ...Hi Liv,<BR/>You're right, Hilary's friend must've felt the whole thing acutely. It's so difficult, intervening with force to stop someone doing what they see as a rational act, or at least something they really want to do. But everyone's acting in good faith, which is consolation of a sort.Spence Kennedyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11183848895584919812noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-27691111.post-35739872925378146502009-01-28T22:49:00.000+00:002009-01-28T22:49:00.000+00:00Whilst I feel very sorry for Hilary... I feel more...Whilst I feel very sorry for Hilary... I feel more sorry for her friend. She must wonder if she did the right thing by calling the police and the ambulance, if her friend will benefit at all by her intervention. Obviously Hilary was having major problems and probably didn't mean what she said but I'm sure it will remain with her friend.<BR/><BR/>I also feel so sorry for you, Frank and the policemen. The accusing looks, the lack of understanding, the broken eyes which stare at you pleadingly. It made me feel helpless and as if I were the guilty party. There was a lady with severe depression at the Home and when she refused her anti-depressants, it was like this huge black cloud just descended over her. She would stare at you with these huge watery blue eyes and ask for help to 'end it all'. When you tried to cheer her up, she would call you heartless, unfeeling, b*tch, wh*re, whatever. She wouldn't move, she'd just sit there spitting these words at you from her armchair. I think what you saw would be much much worse, and what I saw was bad enough.<BR/><BR/>And naturally, the Mental Health people couldn't help. Not bad enough to be sectioned, not well enough to be at home and the family couldn't cope with her. And the psych wards were full to bursting. It's a real problem.<BR/><BR/>Liv xxx<BR/>PS. Love Innis' photos! Lovely!loveinviennahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08061067320547283159noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-27691111.post-84450653919530936632009-01-28T21:44:00.000+00:002009-01-28T21:44:00.000+00:00I don't know why they can't have dedicated 24/7 ps...I don't know why they can't have dedicated 24/7 psych team provision. They find the money for all the medical/surgical stuff. Why is that side of things so poorly funded in comparison? Especially bearing in mind the huge numbers that experience mental health crises. <BR/><BR/>It was dreadful seeing Hilary carted off to the cells like that. Truly awful. Politics aside, as ambulance people we're the ones at the sharp end who the patient looks at and thinks 'you've let me down'. Difficult!Spence Kennedyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11183848895584919812noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-27691111.post-81541774935081019762009-01-28T20:36:00.000+00:002009-01-28T20:36:00.000+00:00I agree the pathways we have for mental health pat...I agree the pathways we have for mental health patients is terrible. I think years ago there were dedicated mental health A/E units where you could pre alert an arrival and have them met by an appropriate professional............ we seriously need something doing about this huge short fall as it is a huge percentage of our work.<BR/><BR/>I just hope you get don't get 'That Call' for her one day.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-27691111.post-44500146265699229432009-01-28T20:09:00.000+00:002009-01-28T20:09:00.000+00:00Hi UHDDYou're right about mental health being the ...Hi UHDD<BR/>You're right about mental health being the poor relation - which is ridiculous, considering the high percentage of our workload it comprises. The pathways to care are just not clear, certainly for the ambulance, which often comprises the acute response (along with the police). It's one of the aspects of the job I find most difficult, as far as offering appropriate and good levels of care. But you make the best of a bad job, as always.<BR/>:) xSpence Kennedyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11183848895584919812noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-27691111.post-64472805030961249212009-01-28T19:21:00.000+00:002009-01-28T19:21:00.000+00:00She could easily have injured you and Steve as wel...She could easily have injured you and Steve as well. Mental health is a poor relation in health care.<BR/><BR/><BR/>Like the new look Spenceuphilldowndalehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15426833972060254592noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-27691111.post-47509466633973764362009-01-28T16:31:00.000+00:002009-01-28T16:31:00.000+00:00Hi AnonUnfortunately, arresting her (forcible dete...Hi Anon<BR/><BR/>Unfortunately, arresting her (forcible detention under Section 136 Mental Health Act), was the only viable option. Hospital isn't a safe environment. The staff don't have any powers of restraint, so she could easily have said that she didn't want to be treated and walked out. In her state, she would almost certainly have made a serious attempt to kill herself straight away. So what the nursing staff would've done would've been to ask the police to section her as soon as she'd left the premises, and she'd have ended up in the cells that way, too. <BR/><BR/>Of course, the other thing to bear in mind is that Hilary was definitely a danger to others. It was lucky the car she threw herself in front of didn't end up swerving and ploughing into oncoming traffic etc. If she absconded from the hospital (easier to do than from a cell), she might have caused someone else some harm. <BR/><BR/>She'd only be in the cell for 72 hours max (prob much less) - and then, if she's thought by doctors/ASWs to be a risk, they'd apply for a Section 2 to arrange further (involuntary) treatment. <BR/><BR/>I agree, though. We're very poorly set up to deal with these mental health crises. Hospitals are overstretched just dealing with the physically sick, and the police are there for public order / crime. Neither have the time or facilities (certainly round here, at least) to provide a safe, secure and sympathetic environment for these patients. <BR/><BR/>Thanks for the comment :)Spence Kennedyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11183848895584919812noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-27691111.post-34611716484024623452009-01-28T16:15:00.000+00:002009-01-28T16:15:00.000+00:00Poor woman. She sounds like she was desperate to k...Poor woman. She sounds like she was desperate to kill herself. <BR/><BR/>I don't understand why they decided to arrest her, though. The last place a person with mental health problems should be is a cold, empty cell with unsympathetic custody sergeants 'looking after' her. At least in A&E she would be looked after by people who are trained to care.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.com